Therapists Have Messy Marriages Too | with Desirae Ysasi

But you haven't complimented my hair yet.

Well, I was about to.

I could you like, an hour ago. You're the first person seeing me with this hair. Like I was going to say. Adam hasn't seen me.

I was going to say, you look fancy. You look like you put it together for it. For your. Is this your first podcast?

I have done some, like, local podcasts.

Yeah.

I did one, maybe a year or so ago. There's a San Antonio group of women there called the. The Working Moms of San Antonio. And, they have, like, this nice co-working space for, like, mom preneur ers who work from home, but, like, you know, you're working from home and the laundry's calling, or the dog needs to be let out or your kids are everywhere. So they have like a co-working space and they try to like, do workshops and things to support working moms. So they had me on their podcast very generously a while back. Yeah.

So their target is definitely San Antonio.

Yeah, it's very San Antonio. And the funny thing is my it was during the summer, so my daughter was home. And so she's upstairs and I'm like, okay, going into my office. I'm going to be on a podcast. So like don't come knock on the door, like, don't interrupt me. And she looks at me and she just goes, mom, whatever you do, just don't be weird. And she was like, okay, I'll do my best. That's actually not bad advice. So.

Did she give you any advice for today?

She did not give me advice, but I did tell her about it when you, like, first mentioned, it. And, I was like, I don't know, should I do it? And like, a true, like, therapist kid. Her first response was, well, do you want to do it?

Yeah, totally.

And I said, yeah, I think I do. Zach's my friend and I like talking to him. And I said, but what if I'm boring? And she goes, then just don't be boring.

Yeah.

Like, Okay. Yeah.

It's okay. I think boring can be good sometimes. That's like from a movie. Boring could be good, right? Boring. Oh, that's that's going to bug me the whole time. But is it.

It's not ringing a bell for me, bro.

It's going to come to me. Okay. Okay, so here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to pull in. Right. Move on. You. Are you ready? Here's the miracle question. The miracle question is if you have if we do the best three episode arc in the history of guest hosting of Marriage therapy video, and it. I mean, knock it out of the park, and it's a win for you, for the listeners, for me. Like, what is it? What happens? What's the thing that happens between now and the time we're done talking?

All right. I'm just going to go with my honest answer. First and foremost is, I hope that this is fun. Yeah. Fun for you and me and fun for people to listen to. I know you and I work very hard and do all kinds of things all day long, all week long. I hope that this is just fun. And from fun, if people listening, here's something that they kind of go like, oh, that's helpful or that feels inspiring or uplifting or motivating or, makes me feel softer toward myself or my partner. Like, that would be a win, too. I know when I'm listening to books or podcasts, I think at this point I'm looking less for straight up information and more for like a feeling.

Yeah, yeah, you sometimes you listen to marriage therapy radio like you. You found it. Yeah, yeah. What do you like? What do you. Why do you listen to it? What do you what do you. Is it fun? Does you do do you get that thing that you're describing right now?

So what I've gotten from it, or why I started listening even in the first place, was while I certainly interact with a lot of therapists, I don't feel isolated in that regard. Yeah, I do feel maybe. Sorry. There's, like, stuff in the air in San Antonio, so I'm like, anyway.

I'm pretty regularly froggy today. I don't happen to be froggy, but, that's that's allowed.

Okay. So I don't feel isolated, but I do feel kind of insulated. Because the people that I interact with and what I talk about all the time is. Right? Right. So, like, therapy, so when listening to your podcast, it's like, let me move beyond just right land. And what are other people saying, talking about thinking, new ideas, new concepts or even just a different way of explaining? I think. Even between the modalities, it's not always that something is so completely different, but there's a way that it's explained or conceptualized that's really resonant. Yeah. And I like that.

Yeah.

So I like listening to that. And it's always nice to hear, you know, two people on a podcast, like having a dialog, having different points of views, chewing on things.

So I did one by myself and I was like, what? Who am I talking to? What is this like? Like how it was. I didn't even know. Like, I didn't know. I just like monologues for 20 minutes. And I was like, nope, this isn't going to work. I'm not. I'm not to, and that's not gonna work. So I'm really glad that you are going to play with me. Yeah. Let's just let's just have some fun. So, I probably said some of this in the intro, which I haven't recorded yet, but, I started training in early, I don't know, many, many years ago I kind of was one of those stragglers. And then I got kind of, recruited into the if you finish chapter, like, pay this one fee and you'll finish certification, because I had done a couple of live trainings and whatnot.

And you were I think I did practicum two with you. I don't remember exactly, but but then I go to Costa Rica, I go to Costa Rica like a year ago and the whole faculty.

Exactly a year ago. Yeah. In that crazy.

Yeah. The whole faculty is there. And I'm like, oh, I don't, you know, never meet your heroes. That whole, that whole thing. So like, you're there Julie's there on is there, all of whom I've studied with and then I was like, wait, these are just like, cool people. They're cool people and they're cool partners are here. And we just started like kind of hanging out and comparing notes and figuring out what, how does like, not just practice work but actual life work. And then so for a guess, about a year we've been doing some of that. You in San Antonio, me here, we've gotten to be in person twice since then. Maybe Denver, maybe Denver. Right.

Denver. Yeah, I think that's the only time.

But tell me how you like. How did you get to. I don't even want to say Costa Rica, but how did you get to being a therapist? Like, what was that for you? Like, did you start as a, you know, tech person or did you start as a, as a farmer? And then you were like, no, I'm going to move into this area. Like, what is your story that that you decided therapy is for me.

Well.

Actually, skip to my fun questions, though I do want to hear the fun questions first.

Yes, give me a phone question. Okay, because it's not a great story. How I became a therapist. That's, like, kind of lame, but, I'll tell it to you if you're curious.

Well, maybe. Maybe we'll find out. Okay, so I was on vacation last week, and I found a new, I found a new small, tough question that I like that I'm trying out. So you're going to be the first person that I try this out with? I'm playing, Well, second person, because I tried it out with this guy that was playing ping pong, this random guy that I just met, he was from Atlanta or something, and when I was in high school, I got recruited to play soccer at a school in Atlanta, which is the school he went to. And so we had some small talk there, and I said this phrase. I said, so yeah, that's my only claim to fame when it comes to, the, the school Emory. It was Emory. And, and then it was like claim to fame. I was like, what is that? So I said, hey man, what's your claim to fame? Like, what's your claim to fame did?

And he just told me a story. He told me a story about his life that he felt kind of was his. So this is my new menu. Small question is if you what's your claim to fame? What's Desiree resources claim to fame.

Claim to fame.

Right.

Oh my gosh. You know why that question is so hard? Because it feels so grandiose. Like the implication is that I have fame to claim.

Well, my wife she said, it's either I gave birth to two babies. She's like, I'm pretty badass. I birth two humans. Mine's a little different because, well, I'll tell you what mine is briefly, because Abby, my 22 year old, was on television. She was like on Netflix and on ABC. And so she did she did scenes with on Agastya and Clancy Brown, and she was with Sydney Sweeney, like on TV. So I'm like, oh, kind of my claim to fame is I got a, I got a kid who's on TV and who's rub shoulders with people who we know on the first night or on a named basis. So I think it could be anywhere from this is a personal victory that I, that I have or that I feel like belongs to me. Or maybe you're like best friends with Tom Hanks. I don't know, but, it's my new small tot question, and I and I want to try it out. So let's see what you got. Oh.

God. I feel sorry for you that you're trying it out with me. I'm such an introvert. So, like, small talk is like my comedy.

This is why you have to practice these questions this way. You have to invent them and come up with them and store them in your hip pocket so that you know.

What to do at a party. Oh, and that's so, like, just not me. Well, I mean, my only, like, quasi famous connection is Terry. So, you know,

Do you think he's famous? Yes.

Do I think he's famous?

Yeah, he called himself. I heard him call him so famous one time, and I just wondered if that. If you like, would we use that word? Would use that word?

I don't know, because I'm in Texas and a lot of people have not heard of Terry in Texas, but when I've traveled, people have very much heard of him. I feel like he's well known, well respected, like in our field. That's what I said to people like, he's well known in long history field. He's written some bestselling books, but I don't know that. Right. Like, in the same way that someone like Astaire, Paul or Lori Gottlieb or some other people who are just very famous in the wider culture.

Yeah.

He should be. And then I can claim him.

Right.

As my claim to fame.

Okay. But there's some other cool things about you. You have a daughter, and she's. How old do she for?

About another four weeks will be 12. So we're gonna.

Write. I think Adam was telling me that she's, like, a high achiever. Maybe golf or something else. Like, what is she good at? So you basically raised a cool kid. That's the claim to fame I did.

But, you know, not to take anything away from other people who feel this way. But I, I don't know that I want my child to be my claim to fame. It feels too messy for me. I'm not putting that on anyone else. But like, from a boundary perspective, like, it feels like there's too much potential for in measurement or for her to, like, want to do well for me. Yeah. I just want her to, like, do whatever makes her happy. And yet she's very good at golf, and she loves animals like anything with a heartbeat. She just wants to, like, bring it inside and make a little bed for it and, you know, love it. But, yeah, like, she, she's her own person. And one day she will leave here, you know, and and if, if I feel too much like my child is my life, I feel like that could get messy. Like if she wants to move to Thailand, like, I don't want her going.

Oh, but what will mom do without you know what I mean? Even though inside I would like, you know, die a million deaths, but I, I, I think because like, particularly in the Hispanic culture, there can be a lot of that in measurement with parents and children. I just feel really, aware of it and like, no, I don't want to do that. I don't want to, Hold her back.

Yeah, yeah. Okay.

I told you I was going to have a good answer.

No. That's fine. Well. You're talking. I was sort of imagining. Oh, look, I'm getting froggy, so you're good. I'm. I'm sort of imagining my my Mary, who is, 18, saying anything even close to. What will mom do without me? Like, I can't even imagine her. Like, she's like, nope. Bye, mom. I gotta go and see it now. Forget it. I'm not worried about what you're going to do.

It might be cultural. It might be regional. I know that there is a lot of that. I. I lived right on the border of Texas and Mexico for a while, just out of grad school. That's where my first job was, in, McAllen, Texas. And there were so many people that I worked with that had children in high school. And McAllen is about four hours from San Antonio. And they were like, no, I don't want my children to go to UTSA, University of Texas San Antonio. That's too far. And I'm like, what? You know, so it's in our culture to and people feel afraid to leave their parents too. Like they got to stay near them. They got to take care of them.

Did you leave your parents?

I, I mean, I live two hours from my hometown. However, I remember as I was really getting ready to move to San Antonio to come to college, that's how I ended up here. My mom said to me, if you stay and go to college here, Corpus Christi is my hometown. If you stay and go to college here, I'll buy you a car. And I was like, no, I'm going, even San Antonio, which is like. Like I said, two hours away. I just needed to be away. But there was that offer extended?

Yeah. So you went to. Where'd you go to school?

UTSA University in Texas, San Antonio.

Where does Adam come in? Is he at school or is he after school or. What's that?

I met my husband, Adam, in College Station, Texas, which is where he was going to school. I was already in grad school. What's that?

His college station. Famous is at A&M.

Yes, it's Texas A&M. I was visiting a friend. Well, I was visiting my mom, who was, getting her PhD, and so she still lived in corpus, but she would move up to A&M because this is before really, like, you know, online classes were as widely spread as they are. She would live in College Station for the summer and then move back, you know, to corpus. So I went up to visit my mom, and I had a friend from high school who was attending college there. So I hung out with my mom all day and then that night went to a party with my friend. And, she said, oh, Adam's here. Adam's from corpus, too. And I'm like, okay, great. And so that's how we met and where we met. Standing in front of a keg.

I love it. That doesn't surprise me at all. But, you know, it's.

So on brand, right?

Okay. I do ask this question sometimes in my practice, because people will tell me how they met. And of course, that's that's the moment. That's the meet. Cute, right? But how did you meet your husband? Like, that's how you met Adam. But how did you know he was the guy you were going to marry? Or how did he know that you were the woman he was going to marry? How did that happen?

His version of the story is so much better than mine. It's like, so romantic.

I believe that, too, actually. Because he's pretty, charismatic guy.

He's a sweetheart. Yeah. How would I answer that? I think he was probably just the first guy that I had encountered that just it everything felt very easy. Like it didn't feel like I was being manipulated or, like, talked up or sweet talked or it just felt very authentic and easy. Yeah. So, like, if he said, I'll call you tomorrow, he would call me the next day, you know, or, hey, I think I'd like to because we lived in different cities. I think I want to come visit you next weekend. And he would come visit, you know, so it's like, wow. Oh, this is what, you know, a nice, mature person does in relationships. And so that's when it felt more like, okay, this this is something.

Had you definitely experienced the other like the opposite. Being with or around guys who just didn't like, who weren't easy, who were harder, who was not. Yeah.

Yes, yes. Games excuses. And I, I have never been one for that. Like, I just, no, I, I immediately feel like I'm when I'm being given a line and I just want to back away from that because I, I think because I am so open, and willing to be vulnerable and honest, that if I pick up on any sense that it's not someone I can do that with, like, I just don't have time for that.

Okay. So now of course I have this other question, which is has it always has it stayed easy? Has it been easy the whole time with Adam? Yeah.

No. Okay. I mean, life starts happening, you know, and life is hard. And life, yeah, life can make things very challenging. And life can have you showing up as your as a less perfect version of yourself, you know?

But you're a couples therapist. You're supposed to have a perfect marriage. Yeah. How do you explain that to people on an airplane? They go, what do you do? And you're like, I'm a couple of therapists. They go, oh, you must have an amazing marriage or whatever. The version of that is like, how do you respond to that? How do you deal with that?

I say I'm a human being living in the real world with another human being, you know? What about that equals perfection? You know, I'll tell you a secret. Actually, I've I've.

You're about to tell about 10,000 people a secret, so go for it.

I will, and actually, this is kind of big because, as you know, self-disclosure is a big part of how we do our job.

Sure.

I have never said this to a client in a workshop. Ever. Are you ready?

I really I really am like, okay, are you ready? I actually want to pause, pregnant, pause just for a second. Okay, go.

Okay, okay, I feel the shame coming up, but I'm going to do it anyway. I don't think Adam and I handle conflict well.

Oh, okay.

Like true blue. Like when we're in it. Okay. If you were, you know, a fly on the wall observing. Yeah. You you would not see an RBT skill anywhere in the room.

Okay, so. All right, back it up. Yeah.

Okay.

Tell me, tell me, prove it, prove it. Yeah. I mean, what are you talking about? It? Yeah. What are you talking about? What's the. What do you mean?

I mean, that I can still recognize I'm going to just going to speak for myself, when I get pushed, like, fully pushed, like fully in that moment of. I am totally in my defenses. I am reacting in large part to, like, historical stuff. When I'm in that moment, it is very, very hard for me to want to do anything skillful or relational. Even still, even after all this time, if I could have like a day with Terry and Belinda, it would be Terry. Belinda. Help me. In those moments, like get in front of that part of me that doesn't want to be skillful, just wants to defend herself, just wants to, dig in on her point of view and not be generous.

And so, because there are times in life where I think you're just, like, more raw or more stressed, like what comes to mind is bringing baby home, you know? Yeah. And and that's a really challenging time. So conflict would happen more often. And it was very hard for me at least to be generous and to, Like, like pump the brakes. Right. Like slow down. So yeah. And I still think when we're in it, we don't handle the conflict. Well, what I think our saving grace is what we do exceptionally well is we cherish each other very much. Okay. And I know I had talked to you a bit about cherishing and how I love that as a winning strategy. It's my favorite winning strategy.

Yeah.

Because of that, the repair process after the fact is much easier, at least from my side. And also because of the cherishing, I think cherishing and just like that individual recovery work that I know I'm doing, and I believe that he does as well. So it takes so much more to like get us ramped up to that, you know what I mean? Like, we're not in conflict much.

But when you are, it's intense.

When we are, what I would say is it's for me, it's painful. For me, it's painful. And I have a hard time getting back to that generous part of myself. And by generosity, I mean like, generous enough to to listen to his point of view, generous enough to like back out of my, you know, narrative that is so unfair and so hyperbolic, generous enough to, like, give him a little space to come back to the conversation. Now, let me say this, too. It's it's not so bad. Like he and I are not yelling at each other. We're not moving into contempt. It's not like that. We're not saying hurtful, terrible things. We're not screaming. You know, it doesn't go on for like, days of stonewalling. So let me paint an accurate picture. But it's conflict.

It is conflict. And I know I'm getting stuck in wanting to be right or wanting to just like keep at it, keep going, keep going, keep going. When really probably we just need to take a break. So in those rare moments and I do think it's rare, I mean, it's like a few times a year, you know, in those moments, it's. I don't think that we handle it well.

Yeah, it's there's part of me that, like, I really believe you. I believe you in a couple things. And then, of course, I'm a little bit surprised, I believe you, that it's only a few times a year because. Yeah, I believe, of course, that you're telling the truth. What's surprising to me is that I, I want to kind of give you a little bit of credit just because I've seen you twice. At least twice manage the woosh in a really profound way. Once was in Costa Rica, you remember we were sitting around them and that one dude sat down and he had a thing. And you like I watched you in real time, like, work out your your stuff because you you were. Yeah. And I was like, whoa. She's an impressive lady.

That was actually really, really, really skillful. I understand it wasn't Adam, but it was right. And then, you know, you and I have had a conversation, a couple times, at least for me, that felt like you did the work of saying I can differentiate between the emotional thing that's happening inside of me and the relational thing I want to happen as a result. So I'm interested to hear a little bit more, I guess, about what you know, about where that what that's about for you. Not not that guy or me or even Adam. But like when you think about your own recovery process or process of learning how to to manage the let's call it the woosh. I also want to take I want to do a little bit of a sidebar, because you and I are using language that we're very, very comfortable with that other people may not be comfortable with.

So here's some vocabulary. Is a quick vocabulary sidebar. The woosh is when you're kind of emotional trauma response flares up and takes over and, and tries to convince you in a moment of urgency that you need to behave in a way that keeps you safer. Saying that a fair way to say that.

Yeah, I think so.

We're talking about, one of the centerpieces of Terry's material is the notion of five losing strategies and then five winning strategies, and they're not strictly related to each other or correlated directly against one another. But the five losing strategies, you've said a couple of times, like the need to be right, the need to control your partner, what's called unbridled self-expression. I'm going to forget the next retaliation. One of them is retaliation and then withdraw.

Withdraw.

So we could maybe next time, spend a little bit more time thinking out loud about those from a more clinical angle. And then, of course, there's the five winning strategies you've used to today that I think are that I want to, like, maybe spend the rest of our time talking about. But the five winning strategies are let me see if I got this. By the way, I have a little thing that I use. I saw, I call it three C's and two GS. Okay, the five winning strategies are, speaking to make things better, listening to understand. So the speaking to think things matter. I use the c is creativity because you're making something. You're making something. You have to be creative to make something listening to understand.

That's curiosity. So you have to listen to actually be curious. The third one, crud, I feel I feel really wonky right now because I can't remember. The fourth one is responding with generosity, which is the word that you used. I want to hear more about generosity. The fifth one is cherishing your partner, cherishing what you have. So I use a G there. That's gratitude. But the third C what's the third one. What am I missing.

You're missing advocate for what you want.

Oh that's the first one. That's the first one in my mind. And that's courage. So you've got courage creativity curiosity generosity gratitude. That's how I do it. So thank you for reminding me. But, you've talked to.

Me. It works really well for you.

Well, when I'm okay to say. Fair enough. I have to find ways to make it make things make sense to me. And as I mentioned to you before, I do love alliteration. So I, I often package things in little, little segments. I would have five CS if I could. So you'd have courage, curiosity, creativity, cherishing. It starts with C, but I haven't been able to figure out how to.

Compassion instead of respond with generosity.

Is that compassionate? Is that compassion? Responding with generosity.

With passion is for.

Doing those things together.

Could come. Compassion is to feel with someone. Right. So I'm not feeling sorry for you, but I'm kind of feeling with you. Okay. I certainly think you need compassion to be generous. Truly generous. Otherwise, you're really inching more into resentment and martyrdom.

Okay, I'll make that argument. But before we do that or not, instead of doing that right now, I want to hear you talk a little bit more about what you mean when you say cherishing that you're good at it and that it's valuable and it's your favorite. Like, what is.

Yeah.

What does that mean to you?

It for for me and my husband what it means with him. Because to me it means different things with different people. But with my husband specifically what it means is the, the, the deep love, that I have for him. And affection is something he has access to. So you can probably relate, right? You've had couples who are like, you know, he knows I love him, she knows I love her. And you turn to the partner and you're like, do you do you know that?

Or this one? Like, well, I know you love me, but I'm not sure you like me very much.

Exactly. Yeah. So when I say I make sure he has access to it, I mean, I would like to think that he feels that in a tangible way because he can see it in things I do, which, you know, we've been married 16 years. We just celebrated our anniversary a week ago. So things I do for him are things like, you know, put his wallet back in the little basket where he can find it, or, you know, when he's left his wedding ring on the windowsill, I'm like, hey, don't forget it's over there. But just different ways that I try to take care of him, you know, let him know I'm his teammate. I'm here on his side, not against him. And we're affectionate with each other. Like, very physically affectionate. We hug, we kiss, we hold hands when we walk down the street, you know, we sit next to each other on the couch.

We're we're very physical, in our expressions of love. So I just, I guess if I had to put it in a sentence that that my affection and love for him is something that he has access to, he can feel it and.

See it.

In a number of, you know, active ways.

Do you think that's, this might be both. It might be neither. It could be one or the other. But do you think that's about the two of you? Do you think that's more him than you? Have you learned that? Has he learned that? Is that cultural? Is that something that came from your like, how did where does that come from for the two of you? Because the next question, of course, is going to be how do you how people who aren't good at that. Yeah, figure out how to do that.

So the first part of your question, I think that was one of the things that felt easy about him. He was always very open himself, which was another like stark contrast to most of the college guys I had seen at that point, you know? So he was very quick to say, I love you or to give compliments. He was always very huggy, you know, but in a, in a sweet way, not in like a, you know, kind of more lustful way. It was like caring, you know, like, so he's always been that way. Where do I think that comes from? I think a part of it is, from our families growing up and, and cultural and, and I, I don't know, though I think it, I would say it is just part of the connection he and I have together. It just has always felt that way.

Okay, so what if you're what if it doesn't? What if you're not good at that? What if it's if it's hard? How do you help clients or how do you invite them into this strategy called cherishing? Yeah. That is designed to help them feel more relationally connected.

So what I love about the way RLT teaches us to be with our clients is that one of the or one of the things I love is the coaching part, being direct dev. I teach people very explicitly step by step. And you know, you mentioned creativity. I tell them my version of cherishing doesn't have to be your version of cherishing. So I often like to go into the five domains of intimacy. You know, physical, intellectual, emotional, spiritual, and really kind of break that down. And I even tell them physical doesn't have to mean like hugging and kissing.

Physical cherishing could also be, you know, if they say they have a headache, like, do you go get them a glass of water? Do you, go to the cabinet and get them their migraine medicine when they're sick? Do you bring them tea? You know, like that is a way of cherishing someone physically that if for you being like real huggy touchy isn't your thing, you can still explore that. You know, people often it's women, but it can be men too. They want more sharing, right? And to them, sharing is like talking, like deep talks. And one person is usually better than that, better at that, than the other. So I'll say, well, what about sharing in an activity? Sharing in a cause? Like is there a cause that's important to both of you that you could both volunteer and support and that would be something that you share, and then it can become something that you talk about as well.

So I just I mean, I could go on all day, but I give them like really specific examples and then I check out with them what what's, you know, percolating for you, what's hitting you and feeling like, oh like I could see myself doing that. Yeah. Planting a garden together is sharing something. And, you know, there's moments where there are opportunities for cherishing, like, let me go get you something cold to drink. It's hot out here, right? Or, hey, let me carry that bag of dirt for me. It's pretty heavy. So there's never an interaction that doesn't have the possibility for acts of cherishing. In my opinion.

Yeah.

I'm into it. Cherishing is also about focusing on what you are receiving. And and allowing yourself to receive that and not focus on the part that wasn't done correctly. Right. Cherish what you have is, I think, the full expression of that winning strategy. Right? So if my husband makes me dinner, I appreciate the time, the effort, the thoughtfulness, even if it's overcooked or, you know, he picked asparagus and I would have rather had broccoli or whatever.

I think that's such a key piece of it, like just appreciating what you have, like gratitude for what you have versus like focusing on what you don't have. Yeah. It's such an easy, low hanging fruit to grab in the process of trying to change the dynamic inside of a relationship. Like just, I say all the time we see what we're looking for. If you're looking for the thing that is problematic, you will definitely find it. But if you're looking for, like the part that is and it's easier, it's actually easier to see the thing that's problematic. Yeah. Sorry. Biology is louder than pleasure, and it's easier. What are you drinking? You got, like, five drinks there?

Yeah, I know I have coffee and water. I have to don't drink. Shame me.

I look over, I'm like, what is that? What is it? Oh,

Pistachio latte and just regular water. So that's how I teach it.

Yeah. Okay. Well, I have a question for you. Did you have fun? Have you had fun this this afternoon? This morning?

Yeah. Okay, so.

We're getting there. I had fun.

I've gone with a little slice of awkward. It's a little strange. That's okay. But, you know.

You're. This is your first time, and you gotta. You gotta. I'm glad to have you back. We'll have a couple more, visits, and we'll talk about stuff that, maybe you'll have a little bit more. What do they say? This idea of, like, when you lose your seat, you know, like, sometimes I lose my seat when I'm whatever. Like you'll be in your seat. It was like, all right, I got my seat. I got my stuff. And, we'll put you, we'll get you into the area of, less awkward. So although. What is it? What? What was it? Boring. Can be good.

Well, I think that's what the awkward was. It's like, is this where you want me to talk about? Is this what you want to hear about? Is this a little uncertain? But I'm okay with.

This 100% uncertain. We just make it up as we go. That's what I love about it. Because, you know, did you listen to, the Boat Night episode that came out just a couple weeks ago? Just me and my buddies.

I started to I was in the car, and then I picked up my daughter from school, and she's like, what is this? What are we looking. Yeah. You know, so yeah, she's like, I'm pulling on Kendrick Lamar. So I then I forgot to go back to it. Don't take it personally I think.

No. Gosh no, I think you I think conversations that wander around for no reason are the best kind. And so, maybe we'll maybe we'll come up with an agenda next week. Okay. Maybe want. But for now, I'll just say thanks for thanks for being with me. And, I'm looking forward to learning more about you and how you make, how you make your life work as a therapist, as a mom, as a wife. And, so it's been it's been fun. I have fun.

Well, thanks for having me. And I didn't cuss.

You did it? You get a chance, you get a chance. We'll try next time.